Microsoft doesn't have to conform. The reality here is that MS still has giant's share of browser market. All new windows PC's are shipped with IE. They can come up with a broken, standards non-compliant browser and that's what people will use.

This has in fact led to adoption of non-W3C standards by other browsers such as mozilla. Opera can scream all they want but it will not make a big impact on IE.

Btw, I'm a long time opera user and this browser really rocks. Posted by: kraterz Posted on: 03/17/05

If you ask John Carroll

He will say "Why don't OTHER browsers have support for M$-only web standards?". With proliferation of M$ development tools, many websites use FrontPage for their design. The resultant web page is full of non-standard M$-isms, which render fine in IE - and nothing else.

If M$ were to make IE7 W3C compliant, and then NOT change FrontPage, then this acid2 stuff is all for naught. IE7 would work on ALL webpages, while Firefox and Opera would still look crappy on FrontPage-designed websites. Posted by: Roger Ramjet Posted on: 03/17/05 Opera will still have a particular advantage.... In a word, speed, particularly for older systems.

I won't use IE anymore unless I have to.

Firefox is good. But I've started to notice that, particularly on older machines, it tends to get a little sluggish. I'll admit though that I haven't looked into optimizing configuration, so perhaps that's where my problem lies.

Firefox says requirements are: 233MHz CPU (500 or greater recommended) 64MB RAM (128MB or greater recommended)

Yes, I do have some older systems. On 2 machines, both 500MHz, one with 192MB RAM and one with 128MB RAM, there's an occasional tendency here and there for Firefox to slow down. Not much, but every once in a while I notice a bit of sluggishness rendering.

I tend to nitpick, though.

On my dad's machine, 400MHz, and only 64MB of RAM, it's worse. Notably so. If you get more than 2 or 3 tabs open, it definitely takes a hit. On other hand, my wife's 266 MHz system with 128 MB RAM handles Firefox notably better.

With my dad's machine, I switched to Opera 7.53, and let me tell you, speed-wise, it's like night and day compared to with Firefox.

This isn't a knock on Firefox really, it's a good product. But there are probably more old machines out there that are being used, or can still be used, than you might imagine. I don't think that just because they're old they should automatically be relegated to landfill.

Anyway, fact that Opera works so well, and so fast, on machines with older hardware (only requires a Pentium chip, and 16MB RAM . . or 166MHz and 32MB RAM if using Java), definitely gives it a market.

Might be a niche market . . but hey, if I already know at least two people who can benefit from it, then there's something to be considered.

Ok, that was kind of rambling. The point is that having two free browsers that follow standards isn't necessarily enough to drive Opera out of business.

In a way, I'd like to see Firefox work toward increasing its speed and other improvements such that minimum and recommended requirements become less than they currently are. I highly doubt Internet Explorer will even try in that regard. Posted by: jvahabzadeh Posted on: 03/17/05 Why ??? Are we all clones? Why can't microsoft do what they feel like doing?

Does GM make exact same car as honda?

Are Dells same thinkpads

Why is there not one Database?

This is a FREE market if people dont like IE7 then they wont use it

The only reason people stopped using netscape is because they stopped developing it with new features and functions - market decided not microsoft. Posted by: tomatolord Posted on: 03/17/05 excellent points! But, you are using reason, objection, intelligence, and no hatred or zealotry. That is rare and almost unheard of in zdnet talkbacks..... Posted by: TechType Posted on: 03/17/05 Agreed Hey this is a ZDnet forum, you need more hatrid of MS - sorry M$. They cannot advance, we made standards in 1999 and they were good enough then, so they are good enough now. No more innovation! Can't we all just get along and try to move this society forward. Or am I just being silly. Posted by: bnordber Posted on: 03/17/05 Yes, you are ... being a little silly. True (universal, accessible for all) innovation would be if IE followed latest standards, and CSS1 too. (As it is it doesn't - see http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/complexspiral/glassy.html ) That would allow truly innovative site design. Posted by: naylor83 Posted on: 03/17/05 Check above link in IE, Firefox, Opera and Netscape. It’s "enlightening"! Windy0068 No, but 2+2=4 So, how'd you like it if some calculators made out that 2+2=4, while some calculator makers decided that, no, 2+2=4.79, and a third calculator manufacturer argued that 2+2 is definately 5. Posted by: naylor83 Posted on: 03/17/05 Why??? Are we all Clones? Actually, while we are not all Clones and individuality is to be embraced and promoted when and if at all possible, Automakers follow guidelines set down by governments. They all look different; they all "meet standards" - see my other post.

Microsoft took worldwide standards of html and java and created their own. The worldwide standards have not changed to accomodate MS tho MS seems to believe they should. And they continue to operate by their own standards, not established standards which every one else seems to adhere to.

There is nothing to prevent MS, Firefox, Opera or anyone else from having its individualized browser. There should have been something in place to prevent Microsoft from "flaunting established world standards" and "going their own different way" by creating their own standards so very different from ones rest of world agreed to and adhered to. Posted by: windy0068 Posted on: 03/17/05 An odd view of browsing. Let me suggest some countervailing observations that seem self-evident.

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